Responsive Practices to Create a Supportive Relationship with Your Teen

Valerie Friedlander 0:00
Hello, my friends, and welcome to another episode of unlimited today we are talking about responsive practices to support your stressed teen, and that starts with understanding not just their emotional needs, but your own inner child’s unhealed patterns. I know you’re shocked, but this is where we get activated, and this is where we are unable to hold space for others, particularly our kids, is when something within us, particularly those things that haven’t been healed, are activated. And so whether you have teenagers now, you know you will, or maybe you just love this podcast, and you’re listening anyway, and you don’t have kids, this is for you, because it does relate to those practices that we can employ to be able to show up better, and sometimes just hearing some of the dynamics can be extremely validating for that healing process. To be able to go, oh, that’s what I was missing, because trauma lowercase t trauma isn’t just things that happen to us, it’s things that don’t happen that should have. And we live in a society full of things that don’t happen that should have. I did a training on trauma a while ago with Angela Johnson, and she talked about how our brain is naturally wired for connection, but trauma rewires it for protection, and so when we don’t engage that, we end up perpetuating those patterns as a norm. So Richard Rohr said pain that isn’t transformed is transmitted, and I’m seeing that a lot, honestly, that is a big, big invitation right now in our world is to look at the pain. And sometimes when we won’t look at the pain, the pain gets bigger and bigger until you just can’t not. So that is something that I really believe we’re being invited to look at, and I am heartbroken at how painful I think that may get. And I also still very, very much believe that we have to start by looking internally at where that resides within us, before that we can show up and help with healing and making and imagining and then making a new world, a new way of being with one another. I am offering a winter women’s circle to do just that, that inner reflection that’s coming up in December. I know it’s not a lot of time to think about it, but if you are interested in that space, to go into a restful, honoring winter space, to do that reflection, to take a look at our inner critic, to take a look at that shadow side, and uplift our light and reclaim Our power within all of those things. And I invite you to check out that group. I’m only enrolling 10 people, so it’s going to be a small, intimate group. The link is going to be in the show notes, so take a look there. As for this episode, I have invited Donna Lynn Burr, who is the creator of student stress solutions, to have this conversation about responsive practices, because that’s what she does. She is a student support specialist who helps students to integrate academic skills, stress management tools and cognitive coaching. She helps educators and families to explore responsive practices that build trust, a sense of belonging and authentic connection. She has worked as an academic support counselor with neurodivergent students in a college preparatory setting, designed and taught teen health and wellness SEL curriculums, and been an adjunct and Student Wellness counselor and Program Coordinator at prestigious pre professional art schools. Her girls education program was recognized by the US Department of Health and Human Services Office of Women’s Health. She is a fierce student advocate, and likes to raise awareness around ableism and exploring assumptions that we bring into classrooms and communities. She is passionate about regarding students with positive regard, valuing their experience and their perspective. She has extensive training and education in social and emotional learning, adolescent development, instructional coaching, mindfulness in schools, and is a holistic stress management instructor through the National Wellness Institute. Some of the things that we talk about in this episode are understanding how to give emotional validation, breaking free from perfectionism, developing trust and improving communication and holding space for your kids, evolving identity. I know you’re gonna love this conversation. So now without further ado, let’s get started.

Hey, there. I’m Valerie Friedlander, Certified Life business alignment Coach. And this is unlimited. This podcast bridges the individual and the societal, scientific and spiritual, positive and negative, nerdy and no, there’s just a lot of nerdy. Come on board. And let’s unlock a life that’s as bad ass as you are.

Welcome, Donna, I’m so excited to have you on unlimited

Donna Lynne Booher 5:33
Thank you. I’m very excited to be here and get to talk with you.

Valerie Friedlander 5:37
Yeah, absolutely. Okay. So starting off, I’d like to ask, what is a limit that you took for granted that you have since unlearned?

Donna Lynne Booher 5:50
Oh, that is such a great question. I think a limit that I have unlearned is believing that I need to follow what my thoughts are telling me, instead of being just kind of led by that. And I’ve learned that through teaching as well, is just I don’t have to believe it, I don’t have to question it, and I don’t have to follow the feelings like I actually have some agency. And looking back and being like, Wait, what are you saying and making some choices by kind of raising my own self awareness, that’s been a been a life changer.

Valerie Friedlander 6:30
Yeah, definitely. I’m really excited to dig in to that further, because one of the things as we were talking just before we started recording, is that your clients are really the kids of my clients. Yeah, that’s who you know. The people that I’m working with are people who want to make a difference in the world. They want to make change, and they’re probably unpacking some of the things that they learned as kids, and then they’re starting to see it mirrored in their kids. And one of the things that stood out that we’ve talked a little bit about is high achievers, and how often you’re working with high achieving kids, and I tend to work with high achieving adults, and the overwhelm that comes in. So I’d love to start there, because a lot of this, I think we’re going to be looking at these, you know, generational patterns that we may or may not be aware of, or at different points aware of. So what do you tend to see with the young people who are high achievers?

Donna Lynne Booher 7:36
Yeah, absolutely. Well, what I see is stress, like, there’s a lot of stress that’s happening, and there’s also, you know, you can see that that the kids also are trying to manage their adults, because oftentimes they do have parents that are also kind of high achieving and had These expectations. So the student is like the kids often balancing those expectations against what their adult thinks of them, or what they think their adult thinks of them. And I think that can be kind of running behind the scenes in their head, and it causes a lot of internal pressure. The other piece I see with almost every one of the students that I work with is what they do with their emotions. They’re actually kind of like try to avoid them at all costs. Because right our human brain isn’t like I would like to feel pain. It’s more caged with our negativity bias and things like that. To watch for things so that we can avoid suffering. And so I will see kids do that quite frequently, and it really creates a buildup of that overwhelm and anxiety, because how they’re feeling feels overwhelming, and the feeling that they’re having, they don’t know what to do with it, or many of them think they shouldn’t have it. So we’ll see that kind of like, how do you have an emotional life and also be appearing to be very successful at the same time, because of some of the things that are socialized of what it is to be like. You need to look like you have everything together, and you’re doing it all, and you know everything, and you’ve got this going on, and the way we look at crying, or all these types of things, so they’re really managing an internal life within that external container that’s going on In their families, and then when you get to school, you just add on to it. So there it’s a lot, it’s really, really a lot. And so I really feel for many of them, and that’s a lot of what, what we end up working on. And in the end, they end up being more productive once they have more confidence and more resources of being able to manage whatever comes up. So it’s not that I don’t want to go into the situation, because I think I can’t handle it like this a big piece, and so helping them to feel more like, okay, whatever does happen, I can handle that. And as adults, you know, same thing. We’re not immune from that either, but I definitely see that as a pattern students I work with.

Valerie Friedlander 10:27
Oh my gosh. You know it’s funny because that well, it’s not, I say it’s funny, it’s not really funny. Haha funny, not haha funny, because that’s very much what I see with a lot of adults that I work with as well, is that and and in some ways, there’s this pressure that parents will put on themselves, and I know that I’ve I’ve felt this too, of how I show up, not just in my work setting, but also with my kids. I don’t want to pass on the things that I experienced. I want to do it differently. I want to do it better. I want to show up the best. And in some ways, the pressure that we put on ourselves to do that adds to that space of stress of the appearances versus how we really feel and the what you said, the I shouldn’t feel overwhelmed all the shoulds. And I recently was talking to somebody about the shoulds cover shame when we should on ourselves. It’s it’s this shaming that we’ve learned so we should that we shouldn’t be so stressed, we shouldn’t be so overwhelmed, and then we’re beating ourselves and we shouldn’t be beating ourselves up, and then we’re beating ourselves up for beating ourselves up, and that it’s almost like a building up inside, like a volcano, like pressure. And then when we get activated, we’ll explode on those around us, whether it’s trying to control, and it’s not always like a yelling explosion, but it’s usually control. I feel out of control because I wasn’t able to control what’s happening inside of me, and so now I’m going to try and exert control outside of myself, where I actually don’t have control, but I have the appearance of control, sometimes, especially with my kids, and then we’re into a cycle that we hate, that we then beat ourselves up for again. So what do you do? Because I know we were talking beforehand about seeing this pattern, and you know you do work with both the kids and helping the parents so the kids can be successful. What are some tools that you find are helpful with the kids navigating this dynamic with their parents?

Donna Lynne Booher 12:55
I you know your piece about talking about like, I don’t want to be vulnerable becoming this goal that we sometimes have so that other people can’t hurt us or see that we’re struggling. I just wanted to kind of mention that as well, like in what you’re talking about about when we’re shoulding all over things, it’s that when you catch yourself doing that, and that’s some of the work that I like to do with kids. As you start catching the things, or catching the feeling in your body like that tells you something else is going on and that you’re trying to be something, maybe that you’re not or behave in a way because you’re trying to protect yourself. And of course, you are like being vulnerable is is scary. And as an adolescent, when you know so much is about, what does this mean? About me? It’s a really, it’s a big period of where you reflect back to them over and over, in part, that’s part of their development. So when our adults don’t do that, well, that can be problematic, because I’ll have students who will tell me, Well, my parents are perfect. And you go like, Wow, do you know? And to like, try to delve into that and that. That some of why they will limit themselves so they limit their own expression to what will be acceptable within their family. And that’s really, I think, part of where that perfectionism can come in as well, and that by what I do and what I achieve, how I’m going to get accepted. And it’s unfortunate in a way, because we’ve all been raised with that belief, like, like, those of us who are working on that, that’s not how we want to show up. We actually want to be like, Oh, I totally blew this with my kid, like it was bad. And for the you know, your child to know, we’re also committed in our family to doing the repair, and we’re not going to do this right lots of times, but we are going to turn in towards each other instead of turning away. And that is hard, because we as adults also have to have that commitment to like, Okay, I gotta work on my communication, and that I’m not going to be perfect, and all those fears that we have of like, maybe I’m not capable of doing this, or I’m going to mess up my kid. You also miss out on really seeing your kid. And so I think I’ll work with people who are like, I know my kid better than anyone Absolutely. And how well do you know your kid? Like, really? Because the kids that you know that kind of duality of like who I am with my parents or what I let my parent know, when we start seeing that kids can’t start omitting information that they don’t think their parents would be okay with. You know, those things happen, and some of that becomes part of the development. But that collective piece about what do we expect with our kids and how will we support them, comes from the adults in their environment, like that is part of their creation story. Is how, how do we do this with kids, and what do we all agree on that we’re going to help them with? So just that piece of like, how we were raised. You mentioned that too? Like, that pattern of like, Well, my dad said sticks and stones will break your bones, but words will never hurt you, not actually helpful, a nice idea. But then there’s the reality of their experience. And we don’t, you know, we’re learning so much more about how important it is to validate that and that it’s okay to have the feeling, and then what you do with it is what we want to talk about. And if they don’t have outlets, and they don’t understand, like, Yeah, that’s really normal. Like, you can have really big, big feeling about it, and then be able to get yourself back, because, you know, it’s okay, you don’t get lost in, like, the spiral that just will take kids out of, like, I can’t do this. I can’t I’m stupid. This is too I can’t do it. Like, the whole like, we can do hard things, and it does take resources for us to be able to do those sometimes, and that’s okay.

Valerie Friedlander 17:23
Yeah, one of the things that you said in a previous conversation that we had really stood out to me right there, is you said, don’t assume kids know how to communicate. And I wrote that down because it really I so often, especially when we’re dealing with kids who are really they pick things up really quickly. I hesitate to use the word smart, because I know that that gets caught up and like that fixed mindset and like, you know, the definitions of people, but who pick things up quickly, who articulate easily, who kind of match you in a certain level, it’s really easy to forget that they’re still functioning with Kid brains that aren’t fully developed yet, and all the things that we might be learning about healthy conflict, you know, productive conflict, emotional intelligence, and all that we’re learning those things, You know, for those folks who are listening, who most, most of whom are are interested in personal development, are learning those things. And I always said I watched my parents do a lot of self work, and I got this tool box of full of tools, but I only learned how to use a hammer because I only had that early conditioning of of everything being a hammer and nail. And while I watched them get better, I could see it, but I couldn’t take it in, and I didn’t know how to articulate. I had, like, lots of great sayings. My mom had lots of great sayings that I thought were awesome. Again, when you said, like, thought out my your parents were perfect. That was me. I really thought, like they have stuff, but they’re, they’re they’re amazing, they’re doing all these things, and then I had to do that unpacking. But like to have a healthy conflict, to actually engage, like I still consider myself, even though I’ve done a lot of work, to be relatively conflict averse, working on it getting better and healthy conflict still feels like conflict, and my ability to articulate still gets caught in the emotional net, and I have a fully functioning frontal cortex, you know, fully developed frontal cortex, I should say. So how do you engage that knowing, okay, their their frontal cortex is fully developed, and they’ve got all of these patterns that maybe I’ve started unlearning, but I gave in the first place. Where does one go with that?

Donna Lynne Booher 19:59
That is such a great question. Because yeah, we make so we, I think as adults, we make a lot of assumptions, because we just get used to them talking to us, and so we assume that they also have skills to do that, but communicating is a very complex skill that can often feel very complicated for them, and so teaching them how to do that, I think, is a lot with listening, and I think that we really miss out a lot of time on just actually listening for what they’re saying and what they’re experiencing, and that that we want to make them feel better so quickly, that even like in a school system or we tried to take those decisions away from them, which means they don’t get to practice having a voice or saying this doesn’t feel okay, and as allowing them to say this doesn’t feel okay without consequence. Like learning those things is something I think that’s really that we end up missing, like in a school setting, for me and when I meet with students, sometimes I do a lot of what I would do in my classes, which is, we talk about communication. We talk about social power, like having them line each other up in order of social power. If you want to see a classroom, I mean, it takes being very skilled at facilitating, because you have to maintain their safety, like that, psychological safety and the safety outside the classroom. But before that, we work so much on communication skills, because everyone’s family has a different set of skills and rules, and so we don’t talk to kids about that stuff. They’ll say, like, what is it, what does it look like in your family? Can you are you able to articulate that to someone else? What’s it feel like? What’s it, you know? Like, how do you have those conversations? So I think having conversations with kids is a skill that a lot of times we just, when we’re raising them, we’re like, oh, they just, they’ve always been here. We always talk like this, but to take a step back, and like you had mentioned that, don’t assume that they know how to communicate, because communication is really, really a skill, like, did you really hear what they said and then did you make a decision about it, or did you validate it? And so that question, I know a lot of, a lot of kids will express that their parents always want them to just solve the problem on the spot, and that, of course, we’re like, Okay, can we? Can we move through this so that we can get on to the thing that I actually need you to do for me? And when you know that, you can catch yourself on that and be like, wait a minute, the kid right in front of me is the pause, and it’s a really beautiful gift to have because it also helps them in understanding, oh, you’re modeling for them, how you can communicate, and you’re, you’re modeling for them all the time. And so that’s some of the I think there’s tools within the family systems and also within schools, because that dynamic is always happening in schools, and I’ve just been fortunate enough that I’ve been able to to do really in depth education, in particular, starting in middle school with those age groups, so that they can communicate and have friendship, because it has so much to do with that formative stuff is really important. And as they progress, how healthy they basically stay in behaviors, mental health, physical activities, all those types of things, and being able to be a good friend and have a friend mean kids. Kids are lonely too, and they play the same game that we do, of showing up and being like, No, I’m good. I’m good. And being able to attune with them is something that takes practice and intention.

Valerie Friedlander 24:14
Yeah, I’m noticing, as you’re saying, that one of the things that’s coming up for me is it’s it’s an ability to manage our own emotions and our own pain, with our child hurting, especially if we feel a certain amount of responsibility or that right like this is one of the things that I’m I’m noticing, is like, who’s being centered in that conversation? Is it us and our feelings, or is it our kid and their feelings and what their needs are? And that was like, that was the first thing that jumped out to me, and like I was feeling it. I was real. That was a visceral experience. As you were talking about that, I felt it like, oh yeah, because there are times where I have to really sit with my own stuff, and it’s hard to put that to the side and say, No, this is this is about you. The other thing that was standing out to me is when you said assumptions, and talking about the assumptions that we make. This is something that I noticed comes up a lot in relationships that are long term relationships, is when you’ve been with somebody for a long time, you’re so used to certain patterns that it makes it hard to allow that person to change and grow, because we make assumptions about it. And they’re they’re little, they’re little things. But like one of the things that I’ll use in as an example is if my husband and I are having tension, and we always argue because he’s coming home late, and so we argue when he comes in the door, then my body will respond, be ready for the fight, like when I hear him on the stairs right like, and we don’t even think about all the little things that go into that pattern. And then, when you know somebody their entire life because they’re your kid, the little assumptions that we make there become a huge facet in how we understand ourselves and how we understand them, and how they understand themselves and within that relationship. And is it safe? Is it safe to explore that? Because there are assumptions when they become part of us, like they’re part of our belief of who we are and who somebody else is and who they are in relation to us. Having that challenge can feel like a threat. It can feel like an attack. And so how resilient are you to show up to that? But also, and I imagine this shows up in the classrooms too, because when you’re dealing with a lot of kids, especially from different cultural backgrounds, different socioeconomic backgrounds, and the ways that people learn how to engage for their ability to function in the environments in which they live, you’re gonna have a lot of that navigating of how things get articulated like this. This is unsafe, so I’m going to use this as a way to make fun of people, because I need to emphasize what is normal to create a sense of safety, but who’s choosing what is normalized, and then what comes home, and then, if the kid knows that that’s not part of the way that we function, and we haven’t built an ability to have a conversation about that and process the feelings that come up with that, it’s almost, I almost see, like a calcification that happens in our relationship and in their interpersonal relationships, and how safe they feel because of how safe they feel at home and with adults. That was a lot. So I’m going to throw the ball to your court, because my brain is, like, buzzing.

Donna Lynne Booher 28:05
I love all of this. So because it really is, there’s so much, and there’s, like, a really big view, and then there’s and it applies across all these different, you know, layers of of how we exist and that lived experience you’re talking about, like, do you really know their lived experience? And do you value it like we assume that we do, and they get busy being who they’re supposed to be, because we don’t kind of help them sometimes to be who they actually are, and it gets lost. And so playing that like, I will ask a parent or a guardian questions. So do you know better than your kid? That piece of when you start getting into, are you getting into a power struggle? And this is in a classroom, or it’s in in your family system, in your culture, in your you know, like, what’s the power struggle for you? And oftentimes just that question of, Do you feel like you know better than your kid? And typically the answer is, well, yes, they’re just a kid. And so that piece, I think, is really good information, because listening to kids and being like that is what they think that is what is so real for them, and whether or not you feel it’s valid isn’t what we’re talking about. And so that thing you’re talking about is like, have you centered yourself? Is what we have to kind of just check on ourselves if we’re doing that. So that is one of the questions I like to ask. And you know, I’ll ask students, what would your parents be surprised to learn about you? Like, what do you wish that you could say to them? What do you wish that they knew about you that they don’t and parents can ask themselves and ask their kids these questions. Right? But those things that need to be in place before a kid who doesn’t feel that safety with their parents that it would be okay to say that won’t, of course, and it’s not like, oh, because my parents are so mean. It’s really just they are so, so, so, so tuned in like, their feelers are out for, like, Do you love and accept me? That’s what they’re doing all the time, and it can be so tiring, and they’re trying to survive. And they’re also at a time when they need to be able to be all these different things, you know, like we talked about about, like, you have this huge box of clothes that you just get to play dress up. Like, how many outfits do you choose? What do you try on? Well, like I would only do this. Okay, what would your what would your family say you’re allowed to try on? What does society say you would try on? What your friends say you would try on if you were to flip into another friend group, what would they tell you you had to try on? So they’re really doing this identity formation, and that’s kind of the complexity of what’s going on. And it is, I like to think of them that we know, like we’re learning so much about bias and kind of the cultural things that happen that these are all cultures. Like we have cultures in our families, we have cultures that we live in. We have cultures in school. We have cultures within cultures in school, and we’re relying on these thoughts, like when you talk about that community foundation and that collective foundation. We have to rely on the adults in our community to have, or be trying to have a skill level in the society we live in, under the pressure of everything they’re doing in their own day to day lives, trying to be human. Like it can seem like just a ridiculous ask, but these moments of saying like, Okay, I’m gonna really try to see my kid as if I’m just meeting them today. And I find that it can be really powerful to get yourself out of the way. Like, I know I’m gonna say I know nothing about this kid. Like, could you tell me more about that? Like, I want to understand what that feels like for you, and knowing that you might get some pushback, but just doing the practice and letting it be out there so that they have a place to land when they need it, and they know that they could maybe start having some conversation.

Valerie Friedlander 32:26
Yeah.

Donna Lynne Booher 32:26
And you can be straight up, be like, I haven’t been doing this before with you. I don’t really want to practice because our relationship is really important. And learning more about how tough it is to kind of be an adolescent, or whatever that is, or I noticed that, you know, when you’re feeling like, oh my gosh, I can’t get this paper done. I can’t even start like, you get so overwhelmed, and then it becomes about you turn on yourself. And I’m just curious about what happens there, because it seems like it would feel really bad. Instead of being like, Could you stop doing that? Like, oh, you should. You don’t worry about it, you and then we should on our kids, and it’s okay. Of course, we do all of this like, this is, this is imperfection and beautiful and filled with love and led in that way. And we just don’t always know, and it’s hard not to get caught up in what the day to day is, and see instead, like, Oh, this is what’s going on with my kid and with those high achieving kids, and also, like, with the neuro divergent brains that kind of do attune to like, look at different things and have different sensitivities in terms of, like, justice and like, you have to know those things are going on so that you don’t shut it down. And it’s not that you shouldn’t have boundaries and be like, we don’t. You don’t need to get as upset as you possibly can be right now, because we don’t want kids doing that either. But knowing, like, how do you manage yourself in between that, so that you can be okay and know that you’ll be okay and trust yourself like that, trust that they need to experience as adults, also trust them, but not assuming that they know how to do it. Because if they could do it, they would, and that is where we drop kids off and be like, well, and then we’re and then we get frustrated with them, right? Like, how many teachers just be like, Well, I did it yesterday. I mean, then that next week, he wasn’t, you know, like, those things like, well, yes, they’re not little consistent beings, and that’s okay. Like, stuff gets in the way, and we try to figure out what those things actually get in the way, and help them to be able to see them for themselves, because they do not want to be helpless. They don’t want to be able to not figure things out like those they the like. I want to be frustrating to the adults around me. Yeah, it’s not really a thing. Behavior is communication, and it’s just, again, not great communication. And then they don’t get their needs met, and then they think they can’t get their needs met, and you end up in those types of cycles which become driven by thoughts, which then generate the feelings that they have and don’t know what to do with.

Valerie Friedlander 35:24
Yeah. No, that that is, that is great. And I, I love that. It reminds me of how often I’ve had a conversation with my son who we’ve gotten therapy and so he’s able to articulate now when he is stuck in something, and I I’ll call out and he’s like, I’m already beating myself up. Like I’m getting even more upset when you are helping me understand what I did, because I know what I did, and I’m already beating myself up for it. I’m like, Oh, well, what support do you need right now? You know to be able to ask those questions is so powerful and to remember that the behavior is a language that is so important, and it’s a it’s a clunky language, but it is a language, and it’s often not the language that we’ve been conditioned to interpret it as it’s like we need a decoder, and we don’t actually need a decoder. We just need to ask questions and be a safe place. The other thing that stood out to me as you were sharing about this is that doing the work to be able to emotionally regulate and not center yourself as a adult is so important, because I know that one of the things that I took on as a kid was it was that I was afraid that I would upset my parents by sharing something, not that it would come back at me, but that that Their upset could be harmful to me like, and not, not necessarily in a like, they’re mad at me way, but just they’re if they’re disappointed in me, if they’re, you know, if I let them down, if I if I’m not who? And this applied to teachers too. Like, there was this pressure that, and I’m sure it’s probably rooted in that fear of abandonment, but I didn’t really think of it as it wouldn’t have been, like an intentional abandonment would have been, they would shut down. I was responsible for caring for their feelings. And now what they didn’t even tell me that. I just decided that. I, you know, I took that on. So to that dynamic, one of the things I’ll work with clients a lot with is like having that conversation with their younger self, of, like, I can handle this. Like, if you as a if you’re a little kid, was jumping out right now, going, danger is awful. What would you say to her? And this actually just came up with a client, and the client was like, Well, I would tell her that I’ve got this. I’m going to take care of you, and I think that’s part of that we need to be able to do that for ourselves, so that we can be stable and create a safe space for our kids to have whatever feelings they need to have and be whoever they need to be as they evolve. And that question that you asked of like, do you think you know better? You might know better in the broad world of like things, you know, lived experiences and all of that, but they need to have their own lived experience that the caterpillars become butterfly without the digesting itself part, and that’s hard to hold space for our kids to digest themselves, because it can be painful and it can be really difficult. And if we can be part of the cocoon, if we or the chrysalis, or whatever, not a biologist, we can be, if we can, can feed that structure and support that instead of being, instead of trying to pull it off of them and force them to butterfly that we know that they are or that they can become, but like that is part of the process of them becoming that. So can we hold that space and listen. It’s hard we have to because we have to deal with our own stuff.

Donna Lynne Booher 39:26
It is, and we’re not used to being intentional with how we listen to kids, like, really making space for that and being like that is like, they think an adult is going to think it’s stupid what they have to say sometimes, and it’s just that kind of stuff. And you’re talking about that fear that, you know is a human thing, of like, I don’t want to be abandoned. And if, when we work with kids who have been have been abandoned, and are like, Why did myparent leave? It was because of me, something I did, something I said. And even though we know that’s not rational, or we can be right, we can out think it our intellect, there’s deep feeling in that. And one of the things that you’re talking about is, I think that when we’re trying to do that, like, okay, come on, come on out of there. You’re ready, let’s go. And they’re like new I’m not is that we have to sometimes shift our expectation and let them help set what those are. We, of course, don’t want to be like here. The bar is really low, but it is meeting them where they’re at and then trying to move up to what they’re able to do so that they know themselves from knowing themselves and their limits and their possibilities is essential. It’s just absolutely essential in terms of how they progress, you know, as into adolescents, into college and adults. And one of the things I would say is getting caught up in trying to help them analyze things is a very typical thing that we do, because we try to out think it, and instead, something that can be tried is is just to immediately go to compassion and support. Now, what do you think? You know they’re having an emotional moment and you’re like, What do you think? Could you explain? Can you explain more? Okay, keep trying to explain. Be like, just try a time. Then you don’t do that at all to them. It can be a really powerful shift where they’ll be like, Wait, what is happening to be like, because that’s where you’re saying, like, here’s your feeling life, which we come on with so strongly, and I’m trying to get you back up in your head to figure it out. But that doesn’t always make the feelings go away, and especially in that age group like that, is not what their capacity is at for most of the time. And so they just need a lot of assistance. And just because they can have a conversation or be like, I’m not worried about it, where it tell you how it is. It doesn’t mean that they’re not having a deep experience that they really do need some support with. And they can act so much more mature. Thatwe’re like, they’re handling it. They’re good. Yes, at some level they are, and we don’t step out. It’s also like, wow, that sounds really hard. I want to hear more about it. I don’t know what that’s like. Or would you like to hear a story of a time that happened for me and what I did instead of just doing the advice thing, like you’re kind of doing that, like they are entities of their own, and we oftentimes, I think can forget that.

Valerie Friedlander 42:43
Yeah, absolutely. Oh, this has been wonderful. Thank you so much for sharing everything that you have shared. Where can people connect more with you?

Donna Lynne Booher 42:55
Typically, I just, you know, I’m I’m on LinkedIn, and people usually find me off LinkedIn, and just from talking with parents and working with kids, I have a very big network from doing this work with different populations. So that’s pretty usually doing finding me on LinkedIn and contacting me out from there, my phone and my email are on there.

Valerie Friedlander 43:18
I will have that linked in the show notes, so that if people have questions about things that you shared or looking for resources or support, then they can reach out and be in touch. So I like to wrap up with a couple questions. One is, what does it mean to you to be unlimited?

Donna Lynne Booher 43:38
For me to be unlimited is to have an awareness of the systems that are operating around me with some clarity, and then have the internal resources that I can call on to kind of manage how I interpret and live in the world, so that I can live how I want to in terms of who I am in the world and how I show up for me, that’s that’s what that looks like.

Valerie Friedlander 44:07
And when you want to evoke that unlimited feeling, what song do you listen to?

Donna Lynne Booher 44:13
Oh, so many good songs from the 80s can kind of help out with that. But I think right now, probably fighter by Christina Aguilera.

Valerie Friedlander 44:24
Nice.

Donna Lynne Booher 44:25
That’s been a good one.

Valerie Friedlander 44:27
I will add that to the unlimited playlist. Thank you so much Donna for joining me. It has been a real pleasure having you on.

Donna Lynne Booher 44:37
Thank you. It’s been so nice to talk with you. Thanks very much to you and your listeners for just interest in how we how we work with kids and and help them. I really, really appreciate you. Thank you.

Valerie Friedlander 44:50
Thanks for listening. I so appreciate you being here. If you got something out of today’s episode, please share it, leave me a review, take a screenshot and post it on social with a shout out to me. Send it to a friend, or, you know, all of the above. Want to hang out more, join me on Instagram, or, better yet, get on my mailing list to make sure you don’t miss out on anything, and remember your possibilities are as unlimited as you are. Allow yourself to shine, my friend, the world needs your light. See you next time you.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai